sgulley
Superstar
If you really like music and recording it then never stop trying to get better at it.
Posts: 2,994
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Post by sgulley on May 4, 2008 23:12:08 GMT
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Post by mcarp555 on May 5, 2008 22:14:50 GMT
This is not too bad. The guitars are buzzsaw sharp, but it works well in this context. Bass is nice and bubbly. Drums are probably a bit overwhelmed by the guitars, but at least they're not sounding out of place, except for the rapid paradiddling behind the final lyric. Vocals are still somewhat tinny, but much less so than the previous song, and gives them an edge like the guitars. This was mixed on the computer too, wasn't it? A much better mix than the last song, and as before, the parts are really 'parts', and that makes a big difference.
So overall, good performance, strong mix, tho a little minor tweaking here and there wouldn't hurt. I think when you get a handle on PC mixing, it'll work out better for you than the 2488, which is somewhat amazing, since the 2488 has dedicated mixing functions, rather than just a mouse.
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Post by Girl Friday on May 5, 2008 23:37:29 GMT
Cool song, great guitars, great lyrics! Good job, Stan!
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Post by Tom on May 6, 2008 14:53:13 GMT
Nice tune Stan. I'm with Mike on most accounts of how the recording sounds - especially on how the parts stand out. I might want to hear the bass a little better. Love the lyrics - the message is a pretty good reflection of our times IMO.
tom
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sgulley
Superstar
If you really like music and recording it then never stop trying to get better at it.
Posts: 2,994
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Post by sgulley on May 6, 2008 15:55:52 GMT
Thank you-all for the comments and encouragement. Mike: EZDrummer seems to make a difference with the drums sitting better inside the mix (& they are easy to build). Plus the 2488 patterns are too busy for me. I've been recording vocals totally dry but the difference in the last 2 songs was that I use the MXL condensor on Summer Nights which emphasizes the high & some mids with very little low. I use to EQ while recording; which I didn't do. On this song I used the Audio-Techtronics mic which is a better vocal mic. I may redo the vocals on Summer Nights again when I can get around to it. Another thing I use to do was to run vocals through the BBE maximizer rack using my old mic which really helped bring up the low signal coming in. I'm not abandening the 2488 as a recording/mixing machine and probably will always use it until it's finally been laid to rest. I did the 2 guitars/bass tracks as a sub-mix before going to computer. That keeps me off the computer for some of the process. I may also go back to recording vocals from the 2488 instead of using computer software; but the final mixing and mastering will always be done on the computer. That's my plan until I get my own room. ;D
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Post by chrisr on May 6, 2008 17:12:07 GMT
Nice work, Stan. I particularly like the lyrics, but the music, performance and recording are pretty much OK as well, in my opinion.
Chris
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sgulley
Superstar
If you really like music and recording it then never stop trying to get better at it.
Posts: 2,994
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Post by sgulley on May 6, 2008 18:38:23 GMT
Did a retake on right channel guitar to balance a little better. Things were easier to mix after that. Vocals could also use a retake but may put it aside a while and come back. Oh yes, and I need to take some of the horse hooves (drums) off the last line.
Now I know why I was putting off on some near-field studio monitors for mixing; can't get out for under $350 for a decent pair. Guess I'll be blind mixing for a while longer.
Chris, Thanks again for listening.
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sgulley
Superstar
If you really like music and recording it then never stop trying to get better at it.
Posts: 2,994
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Post by sgulley on May 9, 2008 15:19:56 GMT
Finished up the "horse hooves" (actually MIDI gun blasts) with better timing at the end on the song. Vocals are starting to grow on me now so I've decided that the song is pretty much finished.
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Post by Girl Friday on May 9, 2008 21:56:30 GMT
What are "near-field" studio monitors?
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Post by chrisr on May 9, 2008 23:47:48 GMT
About nearfield studio monitors, have a look at this, GF : homerecording.com/monitors.htmlwww.record-producer.com/learn.cfm?a=101www.soundonsound.com/sos/jun02/articles/monitors.aspBasically : "Near-field monitors are made to reproduce music in your studio in such a way so that when you hear it sounding good, it will sound good on boom boxes, stereo systems, and truck radios too." "The term 'nearfield monitor' was an invention of the early '80s. It just about predates the explosive rise of the home and project studio and was originally the term applied to auxiliary monitors that sat on the meterbridge in large commercial studios, and were supposed to reflect the sound of typical home audio or TV speakers. " Stan is right about the cost of "real" studio-grade nearfield monitors. However, one can "cheat" one's way out of too much investment on this : * buy two or three different (but very common) external PC speaker systems (about $20.00 each) and one or two different (also very common) MP3 players * after having mixed on your usual monitor system, run your mix also through all of the above : if your mix sounds "good" on all, it would have sounded "good" on the genuine nearfield studio monitors as well... Chris
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Post by Girl Friday on May 10, 2008 3:55:17 GMT
Thanks Chris. I read the articles. This is an interesting topic, because often...and I mean OFTEN...once I mix my song (using a set of nice Bose headphones), I'll turn it into an MP3 on the PS5, then put it on my computer, play it, and it doesn't sound remotely the same. So I go back to the PS5, tweak things, and repeat the process until it no longer makes me cringe when listening on my computer speakers. I've never put the MP3's on a CD or in my ipod to listen. I'll need to try that.
Are you saying that you could actually play your tracks through these near-field speakers and listen to it outside of headphones, just live in the room and tweak it all before you convert it to an MP3? How is that connection made? What kind of wires and what outlet on the PS5?
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Post by mcarp555 on May 10, 2008 8:30:44 GMT
The line out on the PS5 would be fed into either powered monitors, or an amp to drive passive monitors (that is, non-powered).
It is a golden rule of recording, esp. home recording, to audition your mixes on as many different systems as possible before you mark it "done". The audio characteristics of your car, your mp3 player, your stereo, your boombox, your friend's boombox are all different in terms of their frequency response. Some are 'boomy', some are 'tinny', some are 'muddy', some are 'bright'. If you were to look at a graph of the frequency responses, you'd see peaks and troughs to indicate if they add low or high end, have a dip in the midrange, etc. Near-field monitors, like good studio monitors, strive to have as flat a graph as possible. So what you hear is what's on 'tape', without the monitors adding any quirks of their own.
Since most of us don't have high-end near-field playback systems, the workaround is to listen to your mixes on a variety of devices and tweak until you get something that's decent on most systems. It's all part of training the ear. Even the experts do it to a degree; if you ever see photos of a good studio, you may notice small monitors on top of the console. These are usually small car speakers (Aurotones are one of the more common brands, as I recall). Engineers will check their mixes between the '$10,000+' monitors and the $19.99' el cheapo speakers.
And of course, just having great monitors is only part of the equation. The room you're in is a whole other source of research, as it can color the sound as well. But that's for another time...
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Post by chrisr on May 10, 2008 11:15:20 GMT
GF : Are you saying that you could actually play your tracks through these near-field speakers and listen to it outside of headphones, just live in the room and tweak it all before you convert it to an MP3? How is that connection made? What kind of wires and what outlet on the PS5?
Having in mind what Mike said ("The line out on the PS5 would be fed into either powered monitors, or an amp to drive passive monitors (that is, non-powered"), you can use a patchbox (buy one, have one custom made, or make one yourself : this is typically one of those things - as well as the footswitch of your Boss RC-20XL - that one can put together oneself at practically no cost) if you want to connect several monitor systems at the same time. But not to complicate things, just : * connect a powered PC-monitor system to the line out of the PS5, and listen to you mix through that ; then disconnect and connect a second powered monitor system, etc...
Still, if you want to know more about patchboxes (and how to make one), google at bit, and you will find what you need.
Mind you, GF, you'll need a soldering iron etc..., so if you are not fully technically equipped (hm..) already, and/or if you prefer not to burn your fingers, your desk, your carpet, or the dog, it's probably not worth it.
Chris
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Post by mcarp555 on May 10, 2008 12:04:13 GMT
While an important part of any good studio, it might be a bit much for someone mixing through headphones to make a leap into a multi-monitor environment requiring a patchbay. Especially considering the portability aspect of the PS5 itself. At any rate, it's jumping the gun; First she has to get a monitoring system; Second she has to get another one; Third, she would need to decide that simply unplugging one and plugging in the other is not the way to go. I think that day is some ways off yet.
Remember, it's horse, then cart. Horse, then cart...
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Post by mcarp555 on May 10, 2008 14:38:10 GMT
Stan, I think the mix is much improved. Bass is much stronger, and takes some of the sharpness out of the guitars, without them losing any bite. I'd drop the horse hooves/gunshots altogether. I don't think they work, and just clutter the ending needlessly.
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